Author Topic: Full size cabin on a widebody or a standard  (Read 738 times)

Offline Rene

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Full size cabin on a widebody or a standard
« on: August 16, 2020, 07:46:47 PM »
I have a very tight garage to work in and was considering building the Standard Toleman and now the Widebody as it will just make it through the garage doors to get it out if I'm creative.  I have 2 questions.

Question #1: can I put a large cabin on either of them as my wife is sun sensitive and she'll be spending most her day inside while I fish between Maine and Mass. I notice the Jumbo can have a nice size cabin in most cases that I really like.  Can I do that with a Wide or Standard?  Reasons please? 

Question #2: the Widebody is said to be a great offshore fishing boat and the standard I hear is best inshore.  There's not much difference in length and width.  What makes one so much more seaworthy than the other?  Thanks in advance for any advice.
« Last Edit: August 17, 2020, 05:45:45 AM by Rene »

Offline narvik

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Re: Full size cabin on a widebody or a standard
« Reply #1 on: August 17, 2020, 03:37:36 AM »
Hei, I am building a widebody in Norway, and have put some thinking into the cabin design. First you have to remember that the widebody is not that big and the hull is quite sleek. I will have a shortened cuddy and then a shortened wheelhouse. When I first started the build and saw the dimensions take shape, I was impressed by the size, but now, after the flip and building the cuddy, I am not so impressed any more. Of course, I love the boat, but it is not that big. The most important step was to simulate different solutions for the interior, using cardboard. This said I will try to give you some ideas about what is possible on a widebody:
Cabin size will cost you deck space. Of course, you can build a widebody for traveling and with berths, but then you will not get any decent fishing deck.
Cabin size will change the boats proportions, both it’s looks, but also weight distribution, center of gravity and how it reacts to wind. Once again some arguments to stay reasonable.
And its important to realize how much space you can win by adding some width. So yes, the standard will be much smaller on the inside. And the jumbo is a whole new category.

In my mind the widebody will work fine (and look fine) with a small cabin. I would not go for the standard, even if it is doable. And I doubt that you can build a very comfortable cabin on a boat of this size. The cabin will be more like a small camper van. Lots of multifunctional details crammed into a confined space. I will accept that, but I don’t know how that will fit your needs.

All the Tolmans handle great. But all reports I have red indicate that seaworthiness increases when you move from the standard to the widebody or even bigger. There is no single design detail, but simply a little more width, weight, bigger engine, and so on. Just all these details adding up to make you feel safer.

Good luck Peter

Offline Rene

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Re: Full size cabin on a widebody or a standard
« Reply #2 on: August 17, 2020, 06:28:09 AM »
Thanks Peter,

You helped me quite a bit. So many questions I need to research before I start. 
I'd love to see pics of your build if you can post some. Happy building, Rene.

Offline tananaBrian

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Re: Full size cabin on a widebody or a standard
« Reply #3 on: August 17, 2020, 07:12:31 AM »
Neither the Standard or Widebody were designed for extensive, heavier, cabins as you've stated ... and the Standard wasn't designed for any cabin at all.  THAT said, you CAN do it, but just keep it very light and mostly an open shell - Renn's last Jumbo build had cabin sides that were only 1/8" thick if I recall, and it served the purpose.  You just don't want to get top-heavy and/or invite too many windage issues (docking, drifting) - the wind blowing the boat around.  You may consider a Bimini type arrangement as well.  They are super-light and serve the purpose as well ... You could do it on a Standard or a Widebody.  The Widebody is fine with a light house/cuddy on it ... well-proven.

Give the boat a cuddy and nice windshield, then do this - that's what I would do:


bd
« Last Edit: August 17, 2020, 07:14:09 AM by tananaBrian »
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Offline jim shula

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Re: Full size cabin on a widebody or a standard
« Reply #4 on: August 17, 2020, 08:25:15 AM »
I built a widebody with cabin and house a few years ago.  I wanted to get close to the lines of Mike Schlecter's widebody (pics are in the albums at tolmanskiffs.com), but also the ergonomics had to work if we were going to use the boat and be happy.  One requirement was sitting headroom in the cabin.  Another was comfortable cushions on the bunks which ended up being 5" thick.  With those guidelines, the cabin roof came out 3 -4" higher than I really wanted even though I dropped the height of the bunks a few inches. If you go too low with them, you end up sitting with your knees in your chin. To keep the height of the pilothouse roof as low as possible, I built a step down into the house from the cockpit.  The boat caught a lot of wind for sure, but any Tolman will as they are such light boats for their size.

Dave Wright built a nice widebody after mine, and he got a lot closer to Mike Schlecter's look.  He put up a few pics a mont or two ago when he sold it.

Offline Kobuk

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Re: Full size cabin on a widebody or a standard
« Reply #5 on: August 18, 2020, 11:07:47 AM »
I agree with TananaBrian that a biminy could be a good solution for sun/spray shade as well as tight garage quarters.  Renn addresses your questions regarding the capacity/operational differences between the three hulls quite thoroughly in the book. The internal capacity of the WB is 15% greater than the Standard.  The WB accommodates a cuddy and pilothouse quite well, especially if you keep it light and minimalistic, and you can certainly build out a larger more tricked out cabin on the WB if you want to suffer the additional weight and windage.  If you want space for sink, head, and other such nonsense then the Jumbo is the better size option.  For reference: my pilothouse provides the same sun coverage (probably a good bit more) and interior space as the biminy Brian depicted.  My skiff is not decked, so I gain (or, rather, don't lose) about 6" of headroom there. I kept my roof heights as low as possible/practical. I'm 5'9" and sized everything to fit me; I can just sit upright in my cuddy, and have 2"+ head clearance at the wheel.  A 6'+ tall person can comfortably move around in the pilothouse and stand erect in the center without knocking her/his head when it's rough.  Inside the cuddy, I have a twin-width bunk on the port side; a small gimballed alcohol stove and lots of storage on the starboard.  My 22' WB so configured when trailered fits through a 9' x 9' door with a few inches to spare on top, and can be squeezed into a 28' deep bay.  Those dimensions should be considered to be pretty much the minimum.  Most folks don't seem overly concerned with weight, but I was/am, and my skiff is light enough that I can tow it with a first generation Tacoma.

« Last Edit: August 18, 2020, 11:58:39 AM by Kobuk »
22' Widebody
Started: 3/2019
Flipped: 6/2019
Floated: 6/2020

Offline Arne K

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Re: Full size cabin on a widebody or a standard
« Reply #6 on: August 18, 2020, 04:33:39 PM »
If you're only constrained by width, you can stretch a Widebody a couple of feet in length and have a full size pilothouse and a good fishing cockpit. I have no regrets with mine. I will chase tuna to 55 miles out and burn half the fuel that the fiberglass and aluminum boats do.
"K-Newt": 23'-6" Widebody Pilothouse powered by Yamaha 115hp. Launched Aug 2019.

Offline Rene

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Re: Full size cabin on a widebody or a standard
« Reply #7 on: August 18, 2020, 06:55:47 PM »
Would you consider going that far out with an 18 - 20 ft standard body? Curious on your thoughts.

Offline Arne K

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Re: Full size cabin on a widebody or a standard
« Reply #8 on: August 18, 2020, 07:40:12 PM »
Would you consider going that far out with an 18 - 20 ft standard body? Curious on your thoughts.

Not me but I'm sure some people would. There are a few that do it in 20' aluminum boats but man, it's a long ride in if the wind comes up unexpectedly.
"K-Newt": 23'-6" Widebody Pilothouse powered by Yamaha 115hp. Launched Aug 2019.